In short
- Joel Veitch of Rathergood.com produced a song and video called Ninja in 2005
- Coca Cola have made an advert which looks and sounds almost exactly the same.
- Whether this is actually a copyright infringement, I don’t know, as I am not a music lawyer.
- But I do know that it is absolutely without permission and really scummy.
- So I’ve turned this into a short video, filmed in a 5 minute work break in the office stairwell using a webcam borrowed from the bloke upstairs. (Thanks Iain.)
BTW: I’m not just some random nutter who’s picked this up. Joel is a regular member of the B3ta community, which I co-founded, and I don’t like seeing members work getting purloined for commercial purposes without their permission / cash in their pocket.
UPDATE (3rd Jan 2007): Sky News have picked up the story and interviewed Joel, watch this on YouTube. Also a report on the BBC news site, and apparently Channel 5 and Channel 4 news have both filmed something too.
That’s disgraceful. Presumably Mr Veitch doesn’t have the money to take legal action? He should if possible.
Certainly looks like a rip-off. But it’s not the first time lazy advertising execs have stolen stuff from others. Tell Private Eye. they often print stories about ad companies stealing ideas.
I guess in some ways Joel should be flattered. The ad agency that did it probably didn’t think anybody would find out, It is blatant plagiarism anyone can see that, however I’m sure they will just call it a parody, they’re not actually using Joels work just his idea. I’d suggest contacting coke directly before threatening legal action and get a response from them, if anything he may just get a truck load of free coke. Alternatively it does add to my earlier suggestion that you should setup an ad agency and use the talent to generate ideas. The virgin challenge generated some fantastic ideas, yet another agency got paid for it.
I think you do have a case where the essence of the work has been lifted. I did some work some time ago where Radio Orwell had lifted the jingles from San Diego KFMB and I could prove the music chord sequences were the same and the rhythms were too similar not to have been nicked. For all the time you don’t complain or take action Rob then these people will nick stuff from you.
There was a site in the newsletter a few weeks ago which picked up on this sort of thing wasn’t there?
It’s more likely some lazy monkey at the advertising agency that robbed the idea. It would probably easier to go after them than Coca Cola.
What? Coca-Cola are thieves and hoodlums?
Never!
Definite rip-off, but no copyright violation – there’s no copyright in ideas or style (in UK law at least, don’t know about Argentine). The fact that the ad is Argentinean would probably preclude much interest from Private Eye and such. But might be worth complaining and trying to blag free pop, so long as Joel likes the vile brown horsepiss.
I am totally agree with you, but when the big players imitate juniors believe me no one dare to sue them. Also it’s matter of money & publicity. I believe there is should be a way to protect junior ideas from ripping off from big players.
We licensed Joel’s kittens a couple of years ago for use in a game and TV commercial. Joel had an original idea – we wanted to borrow it – we paid Joel. Simple enough really. So I’d definitely endorse writing threatening legal action – it’s very unlikely to to court as they won’t want the publicity and so he should get some kind of settlement, and hopefully not just a load of gassy product.
I’m a regular lurker on B3ta and watched with joy as Private Eye ripped into Virgin and their agency after they backpeddled furiously as B3tans took an unexpected (in the agency’s eyes) pop at The Bearded One.
Definately get in touch with The Eye again – Agencies stealing from or not understanding B3ta.com could become a regular column!
Thief! What the hell is going on!
Been a fan of Joel’s work for some time…Hope he kicks some Coke ass over this!
how horribly cheeky! They should tell Joel they’re ‘muy apesadumbrado’ and post him a lorry load of Ol’ Tooth-rotter from Argentina without delay (either that or they should return the favour and promote Ninja heavily for download on CokeITunes as a pennance)
Plus they should be sued by every ambulance chaser going for advocating horribly dangerous behaviour – If you jump about like that before opening a fizzy beverage, you’ll get soaked and probably slip over and impale yourself on something.
Virgin Coke is much nicer (for my bank balance).
Thieving gypsy bastards, I would find a copyright lawyer and have a quick chat
There must be someone on B3ta who knows about this stuff surely?
Cunts!
Don’t Coke have a bit of a history of doing stuff like this…?
I’m sure I remember there being something about them asking Pulp if they could use one of their songs (Sunrise?) for an advert and when they were refused simply paid for a jobbing songwriter to write something a bit similar.
And was it Coke who asked Muse for to use their cover of Feeling Good and on there refusal paid for session musicians to record an identical version…?
and to think i drink a can of stolen flipping ninjas a day, i wont drink coca cola products anymore. The bastards!
It’s not *quite* the same – Joel’s version doesn’t completely stop with ‘buffering…’ in the middle of the screen. Not for me, anyway.
Honestly, when have ads companies ever cared? Oingy Boingy (if you remember it) was a rip off of All Your Base and even Sky did a series of Stick Figure Ninja-inspired bumpers. Seems if you don’t have the money to fight, you may as well kiss your ideas goodbye.
What’s the story with the National Lottery’s latest ad, with all those Christmas lights? Is it an approved ripoff of That Video (Youtube: ‘Christmas Lights’) or do they just not give a shit?
You see stuff all the time based on ideas from rathergood or b3ta – there’s obviously the Maestro adverts which were a paid for job I think, but I’ve seen stuff on the tube in London which looks eerily familiar and there’s those cards you see in the shops with the meerkats on the front that are blatantly based on something I’ve seen on the sites before.
I’m not a music expert, but if anyone can prove the notes and chord structure are identical then you’re probably part-way there. If Neil Innes could successfully sue Oasis for a few notes at the beginning of ‘Whatever’ then it clearly doesn’t take much to convince a court you’ve been ripped-off musically… the similarity of the video ‘idea’, however, would be much more difficult to prove.
I see what you’re getting at, but b3tans can’t really get on their high horse about copyright infringement. Take a look at any b3ta compo and you’ll see scores of entries which use trademarks or other protected works without permission.
Definitely a Private Eye case. P.E. have for a long time drawn parallels between big company advertising campaigns and ideas drawn up by the small guy (Barcaridi’s “swimming upstream” advert, apparently stolen from pranksters in San Fransisco, yet worth 70 odd million to the agency who pinced the idea). You should point out that the Virgin/B3TA campaign filled up a few column inches of their column recently, and they should be obliged to help you.
Well done Rob.
After just having the same done to me by GNARLS CUNTING FUCKING BARKLEY, i think we should compile some sort of hit-list and take it to the fucking top
I will hereby NEVER drink coke again.
youthoughtwewouldntnotice.com
moreofthesame,,,
This is exactly wat the Citizens Advice is for. It’s free and he can find out his legal standing:
http://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/
I bet someone in an agency somewhere is getting a big pat on the back for this “idea”…
What a con. Pepsi for me from now on.
Ill find out which agency did the work in Argentina. Then we shall destroy them.
Beat them!
With a brick!
In the face!
That’ll show the bastards!
There might not be any mileage in calling copyright foul on the visual element (things bouncing up and down in flash is hardly a new idea) – but for fuck’s sake, the music! It’s the same! An original tune that Stallion Explosion and the boys came up with and I’ve seen played excellently live by a stonking bank. Damn it Coke. Get your own tunes!
No… wait… they’ve NEVER done that… but I bet the guy who wrote I’d Like To Teach The World To Sing didn’t go away empty handed!
A cover version is still covered by copyright and requires the original author’s permission to be used, released and performed, even if it is a crap flash on t’internets. The notes are the same even if it’s someone else playing a different instrument, there’s enough people who have got in trouble for it over the years. I think they only escaped it with Muse because they were only covering it in the first place – getting the rights to the ORIGINAL tune was probably quite cheap (as everyone and their mum was using some version of it for a while), and making “another” cover that sounded fairly close to Muse’s masterful one is therefore a bit of a legal grey area that they rightly gambled on the band considering not worth persuing.
Good example – Wierd Al does a lot of easily identifiable, good humoured “parodies” (covers with different words) on his albums, which he always seeks permission for, and was quite put out at his lawyers not doing so for Gangsta’s Paradise before it was released (doesn’t even NEED the actual artist’s express permission to use it, so long as the LICENSE to use it is PAID for). Recently he’s even taken to doing it for style parodies – i.e. something that vaguely sounds like something another famous artist would make, but isnt directly related to anything. Sure he’d appreciate the same treatment for his own original compositions (at least, getting the payment, even if no-one says “hey, do you mind?”), and legally speaking, the same thing really should apply to anyone who’s composed something.
Reminds me, I need to get back on the 7SOL forum sometime and find out what they all thought of the ringtone versions I made and if I’m ok to use ‘em :-D
Coke bastards. I’d stop drinking it, but I’m not the one who buys in this house, and previous attempts to get our fridge filled with something that tastes better and is more ethical (pepsi, virgin, tesco’s own (surprisingly good), old jamaica ginger ale, etc) have always failed. When I’ve got a home of my own, though…
Is it even worth trying to prosecute in argentina though? I imagine it would be a beaurocratic nightmare. Perhaps they’re betting on THAT, too.
(PS again – All Your Base would also have been a dodgy one, as the original file author very likely DIDNT have any kind of contact with the publishers of Zero Wing before releasing their three-headed Zig baby into the wild.. the bone of contention here is ZOMG ORIGINAL CONTENT)
Coke are a complete bunch of cnuts. Go Get em Joel.
I’m sorry, but that is totally out of order.
*rant begins*
I once, briefly, worked with an agency whose ‘creatives’ would try this sort of gubbins all the time – fortunately all the account execs clicked the same links as them, and understood copyright laws better, nipping it in the bud. however, lots of agencies still do it, and nobody bothers to take them to rights about it.
As Joel’s stuff always has its copyright plastered across it, what’s happened here is a clear infringement, regardless of nationality.
As Coke is an international company, any legal action can be taken against them as a whole – they may attempt to lay the blame at their *probably* subcontracted company, but as they approved it and have signed off the work, it is now copyrighted by the Coca Cola Corporation. As it is so BLATENTLY a rip off of existing artwork and music, this puts them in incredible trouble.
Add to that, loads of 7SoL fans will have downloaded that track from the Mp3 link, thereby creating a timeframe for the music. Who’s going to argue with hundreds, nay thousands, of people who already own the music?
Also, I seem to remember the link for Ninja being in the b3ta newsletter.
In short – Joel has a fixed timeline of the creation of his artwork, viewed by thousands of people, some of whom own the soundtrack, all of which can see the similarity, and a huge multinational with absolutely no leg to stand on.
He should consult a lawyer right now. Coke will pay him off very, very quickly.
Grr. Makes me angry this does.
*rant ends*
Advertising agencies should make up their own ideas or Joel should get paid as a ‘creative’, in my book.
Burn them all.
Even if they offered payment, I wouldn’t take their money.
http://www.waronwant.org/cocacola
Next weeks image challenge, whats the difference between coke and piss?
I worked for a company doing music for ads for a year or so, and most of the time the ad agencies would have a piece of music they liked that you’d have to copy stylistically but tweak the melody or rhythm just enough to get away with it. Constantly plagiarising stuff did my head in enough, but it was the complete fuckwits cluelessly telling you what to do that prompted my exit.
I thought we WON the Falklands war? Bloody argies!
Sure looks like a clear infringement of copywrite, as people have pointed out though, it’s the lazy creatives working at G2 who have pinched the idea. Coke are probably clueless of this and would never agree to using it without permission etc because of this potential negative PR.
That said, they have, probably unwittingly but they have, so they may pay good money to put this right before it spirals. Then, don’t be fooled anyone, they’ll go to G2 which appears to be part of Grey and push for the creatives to get fired and the agency to pay them compensation.
Good days work for that creative team!
Sue them, dammit!
Does anyone have the code for this that I can put onto… *shudders* MySpace? This is bang out of order and people need to hear.
It’s not Coca-Cola, it’s some lazy fucker creative or account manager at Coca-Cola Argentina’s advertising agency
Someone should contact that agency. At least you could probably say the thieving gypsy concerned may get a a bollocking from his probably equally cuntish boss
Hello all! Glad to see that this is stirring up a bit of attention.
And to Jimbo asking how to embed with Myspace, the trick is to go to the Revver page ( http://one.revver.com/watch/119190 ) and click ‘grab code’ and select “Quicktime (for myspace)”. I haven’t tried this personally, but I assume Revver know what they are talking about.
Anyone else wanting to embed, there’s all sorts of options for blogs etc. Just go to the same page and grab the codes. Or simply share this blog link.
Having just done a module in my law degree on intellectual property, I’m pretty sure that that isn’t infringement of copyright, at least in the UK, but yeah, they’ve blatently stolen the idea, bastards.
The music sounds similar (particularly in the context of the animation) – and will be covered internationally by the Berne convention on copyright. The animation itself is not a literal copy and is unlikely to be subject to copyright per se, but Agentina may have laws equivalent to ‘passing off’, i.e. implying an affiliation with a legitimate entity (RatherGood.com). It helps that Joel legitimately licences its animations from time to time, adding to the potential confusion (and financial damage) here.
However, I suspect that it would be severe hassle to persue it legally – Joel would probably do better to root out which part of Coke paid for the ads and inform them or their owning division of the agancy’s behaviour – he may get gesture from Coke, and the agency may get spanked financially via Coke themselves.
Good Luck!
/In IP
“And was it Coke who asked Muse for to use their cover of Feeling Good and on there refusal paid for session musicians to record an identical version…?”
Nah that was nescafe/nestle, Muse have morals and don’t want unethical bastards like nestle using their music!
I’m most outraged for Joel. I’ll be passing this on.
cunts!
Another manifestation of the unoriginality, hypocrisy and cold bloddedness (is that even a word?) of big businesses. The’re such fucktastic crapjacks.
Imagine the scenario if the roles were reversed…
Look up the details of Tom Waits’ law suits – initially he successfully sued Frito Lay for hiring an impersonator without permission, but there have been more since. There’s your legal precedent for using “likenesses”….
Coca-Cola© shall never touch my lips again.
Barkeep…Rum and Pepsi©, please.
Bastard sons of whores! Not satisfied with killing tooth enamel, they rip off a tiny wee kitten of a child. CUNTS!